TweetFollow Us on Twitter

May 92 - Why OODLs are Good for You

Why OODLs are Good for You

Jeffrey W Stulin

Jeffrey W Stulin Computer Software Consultants AppleLink: D1104

End of a Friendship?

During a recent visit to Florida, while staying with friends (a pair of authors), I had a frustrating, ninety minute, one a.m. argument about programming languages.

My friend Bob has had no formal computer education, yet he was able to create a sophisticated poker playing program written totally in HyperTalk. He proudly demonstrated the program running on his new Powerbook 170 (Yes, a 170. He is a best-selling author....)

After the demonstration we discussed Bob's plans for continuing his computer self-education. He wanted to know why he should learn another computer language. After all couldn't you program anything using HyperTalk?

I went into my usual b/s about Turing Machines, and yes you could theoretically use HyperTalk for all programming, but that HyperTalk was impractical for many problems.

"Like what?" he asked innocently.

During the next hour my blood pressure rose to 200 over 100; we wasted a tree trying to outline examples and counter examples; Bob went through half a bottle of scotch; both wives fell asleep in their comfy chairs (clearly not software ideologues); and I ranted eloquently about both practical and obscure issues in software development. But Bob just sat there shaking his head and repeating:

"Couldn't I just write a HyperTalk function to do that?"

What really annoyed me was that he was right: you can do just about anything with a HyperTalk function. At least anything that Bob could conceive of, since he has only had the HyperTalk language to express his programming thoughts.

Bob and I lacked a common vocabulary to talk about software concepts beyond his experience. Arrays, objects, structures, file management, and typed variables are a mystery to him.

End of my credibility in MADA?

This is the same problem I have in convincing those of you without significant dynamic language experience that OODLs-Object-Oriented Dynamic Languages such as Macintosh Common Lisp (MCL) and Smalltalk-are a good idea. We don't have a common vocabulary for communication.

Here is a statement that will get me into trouble. Putting aside the issue of runtime performance I claim that:

The set of interesting problems which can be reasonably explored and expressed using an object oriented dynamic language such as MCL is, while not a proper superset, much larger than the set which can be reasonably explored and expressed by a static language such as C++.

By "explored and expressed" I mean that, when faced with a problem, a programmer must first figure out how to solve it and then express the solution using a programming language.

Their ability to explore and express a large set of problems is the reason that dynamic languages have been the mainstay of Artificial Intelligence, which has tried to solve the "hardest" problems.

I can see that many of you are shaking your head in skepticism. After all, if OODLs are so good, why doesn't everybody use them? (You may also want to ask yourself why object-oriented programming didn't catch on in the 1960's when it was invented.)

The traditional answer (there are others, but this is the big one) is that their runtime performance characteristics are poor. They are slow, they use lots of memory, and they are occasionally interrupted by garbage collection. Which leads me to my second claim:

Advances in hardware and compiler technology will soon overcome the traditional runtime performance problems of OODLs.

In my yet-to-be-published third MCL article, I will note that figuring out how to squeeze performance out of MCL is not easy, but once done (or, in my case, once told how by the MCL development team), performance, as an issue, almost disappears.

Based on these claims, I draw a conclusion:

Sometime around the end of this decade, OODLs will be the mainstream tools used for developing software applications.

Don't take my word for it, I'm just some fool babbling over the link-waves. You can believe Larry Tesler, whose keynote address at the MADA conference said much the same thing. In fact, you don't even have to believe me about what Larry said; my understanding is that his speech is included on the conference CD. Watch him for yourself.

Is there Help for bob?

You may have noticed that this article is filled with philosophical hot air and is disappointingly thin on evidence, just like my argument with Bob. I admit my sins, ask forgiveness, and make a promise. If you, the MADA community, show an interest in OODLs, then I (and others) will write a series of articles exploring aspects of OODLs which will prove the claims stated here. Topics will include: What makes dynamic languages so expressive, dynamically vs. statically typed variables, automatic memory management, runtime performance of dynamic languages, etc. etc. And I will make Bob read them all.

I believe OODLs are in our professional future, that we can have a say in the direction of OODL development, and that programming with OODLs is more productive and pleasant than is programming using the current crop of static languages. That is why I am a co-founder of the new OODL/MCL SIG.

Interested? Join the OODL/MCL SIG and let me know.

 

Community Search:
MacTech Search:

Software Updates via MacUpdate

Latest Forum Discussions

See All

Fallout Shelter pulls in ten times its u...
When the Fallout TV series was announced I, like I assume many others, assumed it was going to be an utter pile of garbage. Well, as we now know that couldn't be further from the truth. It was a smash hit, and this success has of course given the... | Read more »
Recruit two powerful-sounding students t...
I am a fan of anime, and I hear about a lot that comes through, but one that escaped my attention until now is A Certain Scientific Railgun T, and that name is very enticing. If it's new to you too, then players of Blue Archive can get a hands-on... | Read more »
Top Hat Studios unveils a new gameplay t...
There are a lot of big games coming that you might be excited about, but one of those I am most interested in is Athenian Rhapsody because it looks delightfully silly. The developers behind this project, the rather fancy-sounding Top Hat Studios,... | Read more »
Bound through time on the hunt for sneak...
Have you ever sat down and wondered what would happen if Dr Who and Sherlock Holmes went on an adventure? Well, besides probably being the best mash-up of English fiction, you'd get the Hidden Through Time series, and now Rogueside has announced... | Read more »
The secrets of Penacony might soon come...
Version 2.2 of Honkai: Star Rail is on the horizon and brings the culmination of the Penacony adventure after quite the escalation in the latest story quests. To help you through this new expansion is the introduction of two powerful new... | Read more »
The Legend of Heroes: Trails of Cold Ste...
I adore game series that have connecting lore and stories, which of course means the Legend of Heroes is very dear to me, Trails lore has been building for two decades. Excitedly, the next stage is upon us as Userjoy has announced the upcoming... | Read more »
Go from lowly lizard to wicked Wyvern in...
Do you like questing, and do you like dragons? If not then boy is this not the announcement for you, as Loongcheer Game has unveiled Quest Dragon: Idle Mobile Game. Yes, it is amazing Square Enix hasn’t sued them for copyright infringement, but... | Read more »
Aether Gazer unveils Chapter 16 of its m...
After a bit of maintenance, Aether Gazer has released Chapter 16 of its main storyline, titled Night Parade of the Beasts. This big update brings a new character, a special outfit, some special limited-time events, and, of course, an engaging... | Read more »
Challenge those pesky wyverns to a dance...
After recently having you do battle against your foes by wildly flailing Hello Kitty and friends at them, GungHo Online has whipped out another surprising collaboration for Puzzle & Dragons. It is now time to beat your opponents by cha-cha... | Read more »
Pack a magnifying glass and practice you...
Somehow it has already been a year since Torchlight: Infinite launched, and XD Games is celebrating by blending in what sounds like a truly fantastic new update. Fans of Cthulhu rejoice, as Whispering Mist brings some horror elements, and tests... | Read more »

Price Scanner via MacPrices.net

Apple’s 24-inch M3 iMacs are on sale for $150...
Amazon is offering a $150 discount on Apple’s new M3-powered 24″ iMacs. Prices start at $1149 for models with 8GB of RAM and 256GB of storage: – 24″ M3 iMac/8-core GPU/8GB/256GB: $1149.99, $150 off... Read more
Verizon has Apple AirPods on sale this weeken...
Verizon has Apple AirPods on sale for up to 31% off MSRP on their online store this weekend. Their prices are the lowest price available for AirPods from any Apple retailer. Verizon service is not... Read more
Apple has 15-inch M2 MacBook Airs available s...
Apple has clearance, Certified Refurbished, 15″ M2 MacBook Airs available starting at $1019 and ranging up to $300 off original MSRP. These are the cheapest 15″ MacBook Airs for sale today at Apple.... Read more
May 2024 Apple Education discounts on MacBook...
If you’re a student, teacher, or staff member at any educational institution, you can use your .edu email address when ordering at Apple Education to take up to $300 off the purchase of a new MacBook... Read more
Clearance 16-inch M2 Pro MacBook Pros in stoc...
Apple has clearance 16″ M2 Pro MacBook Pros available in their Certified Refurbished store starting at $2049 and ranging up to $450 off original MSRP. Each model features a new outer case, shipping... Read more
Save $300 at Apple on 14-inch M3 MacBook Pros...
Apple has 14″ M3 MacBook Pros with 16GB of RAM, Certified Refurbished, available for $270-$300 off MSRP. Each model features a new outer case, shipping is free, and an Apple 1-year warranty is... Read more
Apple continues to offer 14-inch M3 MacBook P...
Apple has 14″ M3 MacBook Pros, Certified Refurbished, available starting at only $1359 and ranging up to $270 off MSRP. Each model features a new outer case, shipping is free, and an Apple 1-year... Read more
Apple AirPods Pro with USB-C return to all-ti...
Amazon has Apple’s AirPods Pro with USB-C in stock and on sale for $179.99 including free shipping. Their price is $70 (28%) off MSRP, and it’s currently the lowest price available for new AirPods... Read more
Apple Magic Keyboards for iPads are on sale f...
Amazon has Apple Magic Keyboards for iPads on sale today for up to $70 off MSRP, shipping included: – Magic Keyboard for 10th-generation Apple iPad: $199, save $50 – Magic Keyboard for 11″ iPad Pro/... Read more
Apple’s 13-inch M2 MacBook Airs return to rec...
Apple retailers have 13″ MacBook Airs with M2 CPUs in stock and on sale this weekend starting at only $849 in Space Gray, Silver, Starlight, and Midnight colors. These are the lowest prices currently... Read more

Jobs Board

Liquor Stock Clerk - S. *Apple* St. - Idaho...
Liquor Stock Clerk - S. Apple St. Boise Posting Begin Date: 2023/10/10 Posting End Date: 2024/10/14 Category: Retail Sub Category: Customer Service Work Type: Part Read more
*Apple* App Developer - Datrose (United Stat...
…year experiencein programming and have computer knowledge with SWIFT. Job Responsibilites: Apple App Developer is expected to support essential tasks for the RxASL Read more
Omnichannel Associate - *Apple* Blossom Mal...
Omnichannel Associate - Apple Blossom Mall Location:Winchester, VA, United States (https://jobs.jcp.com/jobs/location/191170/winchester-va-united-states) - Apple Read more
Operations Associate - *Apple* Blossom Mall...
Operations Associate - Apple Blossom Mall Location:Winchester, VA, United States (https://jobs.jcp.com/jobs/location/191170/winchester-va-united-states) - Apple Read more
Cashier - *Apple* Blossom Mall - JCPenney (...
Cashier - Apple Blossom Mall Location:Winchester, VA, United States (https://jobs.jcp.com/jobs/location/191170/winchester-va-united-states) - Apple Blossom Mall Read more
All contents are Copyright 1984-2011 by Xplain Corporation. All rights reserved. Theme designed by Icreon.